Just want to clarify, this is not my Substack, I’m just sharing this because I found it insightful.

The author describes himself as a “fractional CTO”(no clue what that means, don’t ask me) and advisor. His clients asked him how they could leverage AI. He decided to experience it for himself. From the author(emphasis mine):

I forced myself to use Claude Code exclusively to build a product. Three months. Not a single line of code written by me. I wanted to experience what my clients were considering—100% AI adoption. I needed to know firsthand why that 95% failure rate exists.

I got the product launched. It worked. I was proud of what I’d created. Then came the moment that validated every concern in that MIT study: I needed to make a small change and realized I wasn’t confident I could do it. My own product, built under my direction, and I’d lost confidence in my ability to modify it.

Now when clients ask me about AI adoption, I can tell them exactly what 100% looks like: it looks like failure. Not immediate failure—that’s the trap. Initial metrics look great. You ship faster. You feel productive. Then three months later, you realize nobody actually understands what you’ve built.

  • raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world
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    3 months ago

    So there’s actual developers who could tell you from the start that LLMs are useless for coding, and then there’s this moron & similar people who first have to fuck up an ecosystem before believing the obvious. Thanks fuckhead for driving RAM prices through the ceiling… And for wasting energy and water.

    • khepri@lemmy.world
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      3 months ago

      They are useful for doing the kind of boilerplate boring stuff that any good dev should have largely optimized and automated already. If it’s 1) dead simple and 2) extremely common, then yeah an LLM can code for you, but ask yourself why you don’t have a time-saving solution for those common tasks already in place? As with anything LLM, it’s decent at replicating how humans in general have responded to a given problem, if the problem is not too complex and not too rare, and not much else.

      • raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world
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        3 months ago

        As you said, “boilerplate” code can be script generated - and there are IDEs that already do this, but in a deterministic way, so that you don’t have to proof-read every single line to avoid catastrophic security or crash flaws.

    • InvalidName2@lemmy.zip
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      3 months ago

      And then there are actual good developers who could or would tell you that LLMs can be useful for coding, in the right context and if used intelligently. No harm, for example, in having LLMs build out some of your more mundane code like unit/integration tests, have it help you update your deployment pipeline, generate boilerplate code that’s not already covered by your framework, etc. That it’s not able to completely write 100% of your codebase perfectly from the get-go does not mean it’s entirely useless.

      • Soggy@lemmy.world
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        3 months ago

        Other than that it’s work that junior coders could be doing, to develop the next generation of actual good developers.

      • JcbAzPx@lemmy.world
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        3 months ago

        If it’s boilerplate, copy/paste; find/replace works just as well without needing data centers in the desert to develop.

      • raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world
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        3 months ago

        And then there are actual good developers who could or would tell you that LLMs can be useful for coding

        The only people who believe that are managers and bad developers.

        • keegomatic@lemmy.world
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          3 months ago

          You’re wrong, whether you figure that out now or later. Using an LLM where you gatekeep every write is something that good developers have started doing. The most senior engineers I work with are the ones who have adopted the most AI into their workflow, and with the most care. There’s a difference between vibe coding and responsible use.

          • raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world
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            3 months ago

            There’s a difference between vibe coding and responsible use.

            There’s also a difference between the occasional evening getting drunk and alcoholism. That doesn’t make an occasional event healthy, nor does it mean you are qualified to drive a car in that state.

            People who use LLMs in production code are - by definition - not “good developers”. Because:

            • a good developer has a clear grasp on every single instruction in the code - and critically reviewing code generated by someone else is more effort than writing it yourself
            • pushing code to production without critical review is grossly negligent and compromises data & security

            This already means the net gain with use of LLMs is negative. Can you use it to quickly push out some production code & impress your manager? Possibly. Will it be efficient? It might be. Will it be bug-free and secure? You’ll never know until shit hits the fan.

            Also: using LLMs to generate code, a dev will likely be violating copyrights of open source left and right, effectively copy-pasting licensed code from other people without attributing authorship, i.e. they exhibit parasitic behavior & outright violate laws. Furthermore the stuff that applies to all users of LLMs applies:

            • they contribute to the hype, fucking up our planet, causing brain rot and skill loss on average, and pumping hardware prices to insane heights.
            • keegomatic@lemmy.world
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              3 months ago

              We have substantially similar opinions, actually. I agree on your points of good developers having a clear grasp over all of their code, ethical issues around AI (not least of which are licensing issues), skill loss, hardware prices, etc.

              However, what I have observed in practice is different from the way you describe LLM use. I have seen irresponsible use, and I have seen what I personally consider to be responsible use. Responsible use involves taking a measured and intentional approach to incorporating LLMs into your workflow. It’s a complex topic with a lot of nuance, like all engineering, but I would be happy to share some details.

              Critical review is the key sticking point. Junior developers also write crappy code that requires intense scrutiny. It’s not impossible (or irresponsible) to use code written by a junior in production, for the same reason. For a “good developer,” many of the quality problems are mitigated by putting roadblocks in place to…

              1. force close attention to edits as they are being written,
              2. facilitate handholding and constant instruction while the model is making decisions, and
              3. ensure thorough review at the time of design/writing/conclusion of the change.

              When it comes to making safe and correct changes via LLM, specifically, I have seen plenty of “good developers” in real life, now, who have engineered their workflows to use AI cautiously like this.

              Again, though, I share many of your concerns. I just think there’s nuance here and it’s not black and white/all or nothing.

              • raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world
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                3 months ago

                While I appreciate your differentiated opinion, I strongly disagree. As long as there is no actual AI involved (and considering that humanity is dumb enough to throw hundreds of billions at a gigantic parrot, I doubt we would stand a chance to develop true AI, even if it was possible to create), the output has no reasoning behind it.

                • it violates licenses and denies authorship and - if everyone was indeed equal before the law, this alone would disqualify the code output from such a model because it’s simply illegal to use code in violation of license restrictions & stripped of licensing / authorship information
                • there is no point. Developing code is 95-99% solving the problem in your mind, and 1-5% actual code writing. You can’t have an algorithm do the writing for you and then skip on the thinking part. And if you do the thinking part anyways, you have gained nothing.

                A good developer has zero need for non-deterministic tools.

                As for potential use in brainstorming ideas / looking at potential solutions: that’s what the usenet was good for, before those very corporations fucked it up for everyone, who are now force-feeding everyone the snake oil that they pretend to have any semblance of intelligence.

                • keegomatic@lemmy.world
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                  3 months ago

                  violates licenses

                  Not a problem if you believe all code should be free. Being cheeky but this has nothing to do with code quality, despite being true

                  do the thinking

                  This argument can be used equally well in favor of AI assistance, and it’s already covered by my previous reply

                  non-deterministic

                  It’s deterministic

                  brainstorming

                  This is not what a “good developer” uses it for

                  • raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world
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                    3 months ago
                    • you have no clue about licenses
                    • you have no clue what deterministic means

                    I can’t keep you from doing what you want, but I will continue to view software developers using LLMs as script kiddies playing with fire.

    • jali67@lemmy.zip
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      3 months ago

      Don’t worry. The people on LinkedIn and tech executives tell us it will transform everything soon!